Regarding the "weather" comments below. Yep - weather is always the convenient scapegoat. In this case, it's a REAL excuse, especially this year! But an equally compelling issue for Vail are the ones Fil cites below... His "crowds" comment supports what my skier friend had to say in the post. TBH, I hadn't even thought about staffing. That's a great theme throughout hospitality. And his "too darned expensive" comment (my words, not his) support what we've seen in with Bowlero and Topgolf.
They might be blaming bad weather for the next couple of years since the price of a day ski pass is unreasonable now. They are losing younger skiers since families of four aren’t going to pay $600 a day just for the pass
The prices for everything besides the Epis passes are insane even during non-peak weeks, and I am not talking for people travelling "on a budget" The slopes at Vail, Breck and Park City are so crowded (if there is snow), one takes life in his/her hands, and that is saying something given the vastness of the terrain. Since purchasing CME - the main van shuttle service from DIA and Eagle to Vail/Breck - it costs almost as much for a family of 4 to shuttle from/to the airports than it costs to fly to Denver from the east coast. Post Covid, Vail resorts changed the housing/benefit packages for slope employees so drastically, that between that and the Trump changes to seasonal employee visas, in '21 and '22 Vail could not open some of the back-bowls because there was no one to man them - and those were two years with phenomenal snow conditions the entire season. For the first time in maybe 30 years, this season I did not buy the Epic passes. Jackson Hole is no bargain, but they limit the number of people on the mountain and is a better mountain by multiple factors, and by mid-Jan at latest it has reliably better snow yr in and yr out. If not there, I'll try Big Sky. Vail main resorts have stretched the price-to-service rubber-band to the point that, for me, it has snapped.
As a CFO, it was always frustrating when the operators could blame "bad weather" for decreased F&B sales at special events. Particularly at festival type events where no specific attendance figures were available (!) Thanks for your updates & Happy Holidays.
I live in Whistler and have for a few decades. The quality of the product that Vail is producing has deteriorated drastically since they bought WB. Lift prices have increased, staffing & training has been reduced, there is less grooming and there are a lot more people!! To the point where I agree with other posters, it is dangerous. It doesn't really add up, how do we get so many more people when lift prices are so high, but I guess people have shifted to seasons passes as per your chart.
WB has been very fortunate to have experienced pretty decent snow conditions the past long while, until this year. So far it's pretty awful. We are getting some snow now but not to the valley floor. Is this a result of our warming climate? I guess Vail may need to extend the biking season ;-)
Regarding the "weather" comments below. Yep - weather is always the convenient scapegoat. In this case, it's a REAL excuse, especially this year! But an equally compelling issue for Vail are the ones Fil cites below... His "crowds" comment supports what my skier friend had to say in the post. TBH, I hadn't even thought about staffing. That's a great theme throughout hospitality. And his "too darned expensive" comment (my words, not his) support what we've seen in with Bowlero and Topgolf.
They might be blaming bad weather for the next couple of years since the price of a day ski pass is unreasonable now. They are losing younger skiers since families of four aren’t going to pay $600 a day just for the pass
The prices for everything besides the Epis passes are insane even during non-peak weeks, and I am not talking for people travelling "on a budget" The slopes at Vail, Breck and Park City are so crowded (if there is snow), one takes life in his/her hands, and that is saying something given the vastness of the terrain. Since purchasing CME - the main van shuttle service from DIA and Eagle to Vail/Breck - it costs almost as much for a family of 4 to shuttle from/to the airports than it costs to fly to Denver from the east coast. Post Covid, Vail resorts changed the housing/benefit packages for slope employees so drastically, that between that and the Trump changes to seasonal employee visas, in '21 and '22 Vail could not open some of the back-bowls because there was no one to man them - and those were two years with phenomenal snow conditions the entire season. For the first time in maybe 30 years, this season I did not buy the Epic passes. Jackson Hole is no bargain, but they limit the number of people on the mountain and is a better mountain by multiple factors, and by mid-Jan at latest it has reliably better snow yr in and yr out. If not there, I'll try Big Sky. Vail main resorts have stretched the price-to-service rubber-band to the point that, for me, it has snapped.
Must be nice to be able to hide poor management and a failing business model for the new generations all into ‘bad weather’ !
As a CFO, it was always frustrating when the operators could blame "bad weather" for decreased F&B sales at special events. Particularly at festival type events where no specific attendance figures were available (!) Thanks for your updates & Happy Holidays.
I live in Whistler and have for a few decades. The quality of the product that Vail is producing has deteriorated drastically since they bought WB. Lift prices have increased, staffing & training has been reduced, there is less grooming and there are a lot more people!! To the point where I agree with other posters, it is dangerous. It doesn't really add up, how do we get so many more people when lift prices are so high, but I guess people have shifted to seasons passes as per your chart.
WB has been very fortunate to have experienced pretty decent snow conditions the past long while, until this year. So far it's pretty awful. We are getting some snow now but not to the valley floor. Is this a result of our warming climate? I guess Vail may need to extend the biking season ;-)